Beantwoord

Bypassing the connect box

  • 1 augustus 2020
  • 25 reacties
  • 547 keer bekeken

Quick question really, I’ve been surfing around to find a solution to my unending issues with lag spikes. The customer support sent a technician over, told me they couldn’t understand where the problem came from, yet here I sit with one out of twenty ping results going well over 1K on ping.canbeuseful.com (averaging 32 ping that is still sucky, considering that I’m rocking a 250 gb for a few dozen euros per month).

This leads to some horrible game experiences, sometimes my streams die and restart after a bunch of seconds, leading to a loss of audience and money. 

So I decided to surf the net and see if something was going on with my hardware.

Turns out that the connect boxes are built on faulty chips that, guess what, cause lag spikes and random disconnections.

That being said, other than cursing the customer service for not telling me this (that’d have saved me a good deal of time), I was thinking of getting a decent router to use in front of the connect box, apparently some people have done that in the past and that saved the day for them.

Does anybody know if that is still feasible, if it works properly, and in case, have a small guide on what to get and how to set it to get a finally stable line?

Thanks for allt he answers and I hope you guys will have a great weekend.

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Best beantwoord door Jonathan-458 12 augustus 2020, 01:56

@Onitgamingk,

Although the spikes cannot completely be eliminated due to the limitations of Ziggo's current modems; Connect box V1 and V2 lines, the effects can be minimized.

Start by using a single high quality cable that connects directly from the AOP or Splitter to the Modem.

Preferred cables are the Technetix RLA++ or Hirschman with IEC female to male F connector.

@Paul Ziggo is able to send you the correct cable.

After connecting the new cables check if modem values are optimal, stable and interference is minimal to non-excitant . (the post error rate should remain at 0)

Make sure you are using IPv4 Only, effects on IPv6 when last measured (11-2019) were still noticeably higher, @Paul Ziggo can also change that for you if necessary. 

And disable the "Ziggo WiFispots” function within your MijnZiggo account, your modem should reboot and pick up a profile which disables WiFispots.

Perform some tests with your pc's and see if these results meets your requirements. (Wired CAT5E/6)

For further improvements bridge mode + a fast router which supports QoS is recommended and you should achieve a average of 8-12ms towards proper servers with limited variation & loss. Most game servers today are also adaptable to this variation.

Unfortunately Ziggo does not yet provide consumers with non-Intel puma 5/6/7 based modems and we are not yet able to buy and connect our own modems so the problem can not be fully eliminated.
(our government & EU is working on that but VodafoneZiggo is stubborn and are dragging this out)

Kind regards

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25 Reacties

Reputatie 7

@Onitgamingk I've checked the connection between your modem and our network and the connection itself seems to be ok.  The advice which @Jonathan-458 just gave you is  useful and I recommend you
to have a look at this. Please let me know what your findings after checking the cables.

TBH I got quality cable but I didn’t overspend, Ziggo actually offered to give some of the money back so I’m off about 30 euros now and that’s ok (I guess these cables are gonna serve their purpose for a few years).

 

I’ll keep my connection in check and we’ll see with the new cable and eventually with the IPv4 only activated.

 

Thanks a lot anyway, your help was appreciated. Hope we can move on and get the connection to be the best that it can be.

@Onitgamingk,

Never seen this website before.

Ping response testing when troubleshooting issues should always be done from the location which experiences the problem, wired and with proper local tools or Apps towards a reliable server to set a baseline and/or towards the server where you experience problems with.

External website based tools often do not provide enough information for proper troubleshooting or are not suitable enough for the problem that is experienced.

Use either PingPlotter, WinMTR, NetScan or PsPing.

Start with ICMP, which is often the standard protocol used when pinging a destination, ICMP pings often provides sufficient information for troubleshooting however when there is an issue with a certain application/game ICMP response might not be enough and a switch to TCP and/or UDP packets is necessary to see where the issue really originates from.

Currently VodafoneZiggo's implementation of IPv6 is poor in my opinion even when having Dual Stack were the client has both a native IPv6 and IPv4 address, and unfortunately there is still a difference in how the connectboxes deal with data being send via IPv6 vs IPv4.

In general you should not experience any problems switching over to IPv4 only, there are not allot of IPv6 only websites. You kind of specifically need to know IPv6 only websites to experience issues. By far the most relevant sites and servers have a native IPv6 and IPv4 address.

Throughout the whole world the move towards IPv6 is a struggle because allot of different factors; Knowledge/Complexity, Cost, Old hard/software and inability to talk to each other without some sort of tunneling this often makes troubleshooting IPv6 issues very challenging.

Then the Cable stuff, Never buy too expensive cables, just focus on the actual specifications & certifications, with coax check for "Ziggo geschikt”, "Kabel Keur”, "LTE proof” and “A++”. For example a proper HDMI High-Speed with Ethernet cable <3m can be bought for €120 or €20, you will not experience any difference.

 

Reputatie 5
Badge +5

I’m seeing large pingspikes on that website as well, from two separate ISPs (xs4all and Ziggo). Those spikes aren’t visible on actual pings sent through a command prompt. Also the overall ping on the command prompt is significantly better than the web version.

 

--- ping.canbeuseful.com ping statistics ---
1252 packets transmitted, 1252 received, 0% packet loss, time 306ms
rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 12.952/16.467/35.688/1.982 ms

 

I would check the ping using the command prompt or something like WinMTR to confirm/refute the idea your connection or setup is faulty.

Reputatie 7

Hello @Onitgamingk,

You should be able to send me a private message in which you can send the right address information. Than I can also have a look at the signal from en towards your cablemodem. 
The pingresults you describe aren't good, so we first have to make sure if this has to do something with the connection itself.

Thanks in advantage for sending me a private message.
Kind regards,

Paul

Taken by frustration, I decided to go and get me some new cables. That cost me around 80 euros. I connected my box to the closest power plug that is five meters away, the router is connected to the main outlet with the provided cable, and then I ran two 20 m hig quality class 6 LAN cables straight from the router to my two PCs.

That apparently solved the issues with the downstream post RS errors. Still, I was testing the connection yesterday and I got lag spikes up to 2830 ms. That is definitely unacceptable; a 2.8 seconds lag spike means I could stand up, do a squat, sit down and get back to what I’m doing.

I “reported a move” to get the correct address going, I can also send that to you via private message if you want, I just hope that “reporting the move” won’t f up my connection, cause I wouldn’t love losing my signal due to this. That would be the fourth time Ziggo leaves me without a connection, and I’m sure it would again take weeks or months to fix as usual.

@Jonathan-458 wouldn’t moving down to ipv4 only cause disturbance with those websites that run ipv6 only? I’ve done pretty much all the rest. Thanks for your answer! My ping measured via https://ping.canbeuseful.com/en#ping still averages around 35/40, that is disappointing especially considering that we’re still talking lag spikes.

 

Reputatie 7

@Onitgamingk What @Jonathan-458 says is right. We should start by connecting the Ziggo modem by using a proper cable. Due to your description I understand we didn't send you the right cable to connect the modem.

I will send you the right cable which is necessary to properly connect the modem to the AOP (Ziggo Connection). You will receive the cable within 2 to 3 days. 
Let us know what your findings are with the new cable. Note: I notice the address in your profile doesn't seem to be right. Can you fill in the right postalcode and housenumber so I can send the cable?

@Onitgamingk,

Although the spikes cannot completely be eliminated due to the limitations of Ziggo's current modems; Connect box V1 and V2 lines, the effects can be minimized.

Start by using a single high quality cable that connects directly from the AOP or Splitter to the Modem.

Preferred cables are the Technetix RLA++ or Hirschman with IEC female to male F connector.

@Paul Ziggo is able to send you the correct cable.

After connecting the new cables check if modem values are optimal, stable and interference is minimal to non-excitant . (the post error rate should remain at 0)

Make sure you are using IPv4 Only, effects on IPv6 when last measured (11-2019) were still noticeably higher, @Paul Ziggo can also change that for you if necessary. 

And disable the "Ziggo WiFispots” function within your MijnZiggo account, your modem should reboot and pick up a profile which disables WiFispots.

Perform some tests with your pc's and see if these results meets your requirements. (Wired CAT5E/6)

For further improvements bridge mode + a fast router which supports QoS is recommended and you should achieve a average of 8-12ms towards proper servers with limited variation & loss. Most game servers today are also adaptable to this variation.

Unfortunately Ziggo does not yet provide consumers with non-Intel puma 5/6/7 based modems and we are not yet able to buy and connect our own modems so the problem can not be fully eliminated.
(our government & EU is working on that but VodafoneZiggo is stubborn and are dragging this out)

Kind regards

Nothing at all. I had to go cable in cable due to the connector type on the router, that cannot apparently be found anywhere in the NL if not by ordering one and manually installing it on the cable (I don't have the right tools to crimp a connector on a cable).

I noticed that I did that tonight and that might also be a cause of the issues, still nothing I can solve so easily.

@Onitgamingk I see a black cabel in de wall socked en a white in the modem, what is in between?

Also, my flatmate works with WiFi from a room adjacent to my streaming room. He wouldn't reach the stability levels he needs from his room all the way down where the main outlet is. So I'd have to spend even more money to carry the WiFi all the way to his room.

Remember, all of this would've been solved if only the technician would've installed the plug back where it was prior to his intervention.

 

 

Now I remember why I didn't go with the ethernet solution. There is no power plug anywhere near the outlet. Posting some pics to show how I had to deal with connecting the router to the only plug that I have on the same floor.

Again, I'm blaming the technician who installed the outlet.

I managed to plug everything in, then I realized that not having any WiFi other than my cellphone I cannot stress test the connection. If I don't use it at all there's no point in checking for errors, and I don't think that writing a few messages would be enough to have errors appear on the router page. Any idea?

Posting pics of the only possible way to connect the router to electricity.

 

I will try that also. The cable I’m using has a crappy description on amazon nl, still, out of multiple sources available onlive for the same product, has triple shielding caple of 100 db shielding, that’s over the standard in the market so it should be ok.

Well, that’s a shiny golden cable :grin: . However it may not be sufficiently shielded for interference from 4G cellphone networks. I don’t know for sure off course, since there is no exact specification about that on amazon. What length is this cable?

However, just give it a try and connect your box directly to the outlet where the green cable enters. If everything improves you know where the culprit is.

 

 

I left the technicians who had to install the mai connection in my house with very clear information about where I wanted the main connection to be. They still installed it on the other side of the house, so I am currently running the connection through the cable I linked in one of my previous comments, I will link it again here.

https://www.amazon.nl/gp/product/B00NEG40IA/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Gonna do the connection pictures now.

Reputatie 7

@Onitgamingk Thanks for sharing the extra information with us. What @efok says is right, there seems to be interference on downstreamchannel 23 and 24. Is the modem directly connected to the Ziggo (coax) connection in your house by using a coaxcable which isn't longer than 1.5 meter? Can you also share a picture with the modem setup up and the coaxconnections in your house? By checking this we can make sure the interference isn't caused by the interior installation, cables or connectors. 

@Onitgamingk This shows interference on your connection, especially on downstream channel 23 and 24. That should be fixed. Do you have pictures of the connection from the modem to the entry point of the coax in your house??

 

 

I am cabled with this cable (https://www.amazon.nl/gp/product/B00NEG40IA/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1) from the main connection to my stream room, and then I am cabled with a high quality 3 mt lan cable to both my pcs (stream and gaming rig). I would never trust a wireless connection for gaming. I will send a picture of the system in a few if that is relevant. I will also upload three screenshots with all the data.

 

 

Good afthernoon @Onitgamingk,  first of all welcome to the Community!:blush:
 

I understand very well that you want a stable connection during gaming and streaming. Especially if you can make money with this.:wink:
An external router is a possibility, but if the problem is in the connection outside the house, this will not solve the problem. That is why we will first have to look together to find out the cause.
 

Considering a stable connection is important, I assume that you have a connection to the modem with an internet cable. Is this right? Or do you only use the WiFi connection?
 

If it works properly via the wired connection directly on the modem, it is indeed a good option to look at an external router if you do not want to use the internet via the wired connection. Please note that a connection with an internet cable is always the most stable way of connecting.
If this is not the case, it may be that something is going wrong somewhere in front of the modem. Can you share the up- and downstream values ​​of the modem with us? You can find it here. We would also like to receive a photo of the main connection and the way the modem is connected to it.